Ray Davies Talks With Creem Magazine...
While we're on the subject of trivia, why don't we clear up one of the biggest rumors about the Kinks. There's been a lot of arguments between rock fans...
About Jimmy Page playing those early leads?
Yeah.
I'll tell you something about Jimmy Page. Jimmy Page thinks he was the first person in the world to ever put a B string where a G string should be. And for me, that's his only claim to fame. Other than that, I think he's an asshole. You see, when there was a new pop group like the Kinks, you got all sorts of people coming to the sessions and wanting to sit in. There were a lot of groups going around at the time—the Yardbirds, the Kinks, the Rolling Stones—and nobody had really cracked with a sort of R&B number one record. The songs were always sort of like the Beatles. When we first wanted to do a record, we couldn't get a recording gig. We were turned down by Decca, Parlophone, EMI and even Brian Epstein came to see us play and turned us down. So I started writing songs like "You Really Got Me", and I think there was a sheer jealousy that we did it first. Because we weren't a great group—untidy—and we were considered maybe a bit of a joke. But for some reason, I'd just had dinner, shepherd's pie, at my sister's house, and I sat down at the piano and played da, da, da, da, da. The funny thing is it was influenced by Mose Allison more than anybody else. And I think there was a lot of bad feeling. I remember we went to clubs like the Marquee, and those bands wouldn't talk to us because we did it first
You must know the story of "You Really Got Me". It was recorded first at Pye with a producer who made it sound like Phil Spector, and there was no way that I was going to let them put it out. I said I'd leave the music business first because I'd never write another song like it. In the end, they gave us 200 pounds—which is like 400 bucks—to re-record it. We went into a cheap little studio, and on the session was Mick Avory on drums, Dave Davies playing lead guitar—playing a Harmony guitar which was like a cheap version of a Gibson—I was playing a Maton which is a cheap version of a Harmony. I had a Wallace amplifier which was custom built. Dave was using a Vox and a little six watt pre-amp with knitting needles stuck in it. We had Arthur Greenslade—a session pianist—on piano, and a guy named Vic who was doubling my part because I was singing lead. So there were three guitars and a piano doing the riff. And for all I know, Jimmy Page must have been having dinner with his mother that night.
Jimmy Page and a lot of other people subsequently came to our sessions when we became hot, and I think he played rhythm 12-string on "I'm A Lover, Not A Fighter", and he played tambourine on "Long Tall Shorty". Jon Lord, the organist of Deep Purple, played organ on 'Bald Headed Woman'. The curious thing is I wrote a song called "Revenge" which had a riff like "You Really Got Me". Our publisher at the time was a man named Larry Page. To get a part of the action—this was a real con trick—he registered the song as a co-composer, and he wasn't even on the session for the demo. So maybe the fact that Larry Page was credited as co-composer of Revenge" adds some substantial evidence to Jimmy Page's claim.
I remember Page coming to one of our sessions when we were recording "All Day And All Of The Night". We had to record that song at 10 o'clock in the morning because we had a gig that night. It was done in three hours. Page was doing a session in the other studio, and he came in to hear Dave's solo, and he laughed and he snickered. And now he says that he played it! So I think he's an asshole, and he can put all the curses he wants on me because I know I'm right and he's wrong. He's an asshole. Dave is a great guitar player. He's got his limitations, but he's never been given justice for doing that. He made that when he was 16-years-old. He created a sound, and after that came Jimi Hendrix and all the fuzz boxes.
How long do you think the Kinks can continue as a band?
Let's put it like this. I don't think there's any end to what we can do. I don't want to end up in a Holiday Inn. I'd rather sweep the streets because I'd be better at that. I'd be more artistic at that anyway. That's the last thing I want to do—cabaret and all that bullshit. But I like to feel that every show is the last one we're going to do because that gives us the fire.
How seriously do you think rock 'n' roll should be taken?
How seriously should it be taken? As seriously as the CBS News. Because there's a lot of junk said in rock 'n' roll—there's a lot of junk lyrics—but there's a lot of great lyrics and a lot of great music as well.
I think what's happened—it's got to be taken a bit seriously because it's become this huge industry. There's, so much at stake. You wouldn't believe the wheeling and dealing that's going on to get us to play with the Rolling Stones. I think it really is a big business, and I came into it just to play music. The big companies have got their schedules, they've got their quotas, they've got their money allocated to artists, and it's all very important. It's also a big industry for the government. In the '60s, it was the only thing England had going for it. That's why the Beatles got the MBE. Rock music is really one of our biggest exports. So it's got to be taken a bit serious.
And those people in "Rock 'N' Roll Fantasy"—it helps people get through their life. I said tonight: "Here's a song for a waitress. This is for a queer. Here's a song for a closet queen" or whatever. Everybody's got to have some kind of identification with something. When I first started out, I used to walk around Muswell Hill and say: "I don't relate to any of these people. I've got to get out of here." My way out was through music and art. It's the whole thing in England—the only way to get out is to be a coal miner or a football player. That's the way it was in the '40s and '50s. Now it's rock music. That's why you get bands like Madness going straight from school and becoming rock musicians. Because there's no other way for them. They can't get jobs. But rock music has given them an understanding and a way of expressing themselves. I think it should be taught in schools.
It's a way of expression for people who before would have just been lumbered in factory jobs, and that would have been the end. It would be like the rough going in Eraserhead. Nothing. And even if these kids make one album or one song, they've made a mark on the world and said something. That's what was the great thing about 1977 and new wave music since then. It might not be the best music. The best music was written a hundred years ago or nearly a hundred years ago. But I'm talking about expressionism. You'll notice that expressionistic art is becoming popular again. I think it's all collective. So in the sense of a guy listening to music on his stereo to keep alive, to give him the will to get up in the morning, I think it is important. That it is as important as the news.
And it's got to stop all this. [He points out the, window.] Eventually people are going to get fed up with what's happening to America and England. The Skinheads have got their music in England. I think there are elements in that, though—I hate to say the word—subversive elements. They're using a lot of innocent people. It's great in England, though. We get a lot of Mod kids and Skinheads at our gigs because the Jam like us.
They do a good version of "David Watts".
It's wonderful. They're getting into our other songs because of that one, and they realize that there is another world apart from that horrible, blank concrete world that's out there—the Eraserhead world. That's why music is so good right now. And that's why rock music is more now than a 19-year-old kid playing to a blonde. That's why you get guys over 30 playing rock music to express themselves. And that's why you have 16-year-old kids playing rock music as well.
read the entire interview @ creemmagazine.com, thanks guys! Nice work!
About Jimmy Page playing those early leads?
Yeah.
I'll tell you something about Jimmy Page. Jimmy Page thinks he was the first person in the world to ever put a B string where a G string should be. And for me, that's his only claim to fame. Other than that, I think he's an asshole. You see, when there was a new pop group like the Kinks, you got all sorts of people coming to the sessions and wanting to sit in. There were a lot of groups going around at the time—the Yardbirds, the Kinks, the Rolling Stones—and nobody had really cracked with a sort of R&B number one record. The songs were always sort of like the Beatles. When we first wanted to do a record, we couldn't get a recording gig. We were turned down by Decca, Parlophone, EMI and even Brian Epstein came to see us play and turned us down. So I started writing songs like "You Really Got Me", and I think there was a sheer jealousy that we did it first. Because we weren't a great group—untidy—and we were considered maybe a bit of a joke. But for some reason, I'd just had dinner, shepherd's pie, at my sister's house, and I sat down at the piano and played da, da, da, da, da. The funny thing is it was influenced by Mose Allison more than anybody else. And I think there was a lot of bad feeling. I remember we went to clubs like the Marquee, and those bands wouldn't talk to us because we did it first
You must know the story of "You Really Got Me". It was recorded first at Pye with a producer who made it sound like Phil Spector, and there was no way that I was going to let them put it out. I said I'd leave the music business first because I'd never write another song like it. In the end, they gave us 200 pounds—which is like 400 bucks—to re-record it. We went into a cheap little studio, and on the session was Mick Avory on drums, Dave Davies playing lead guitar—playing a Harmony guitar which was like a cheap version of a Gibson—I was playing a Maton which is a cheap version of a Harmony. I had a Wallace amplifier which was custom built. Dave was using a Vox and a little six watt pre-amp with knitting needles stuck in it. We had Arthur Greenslade—a session pianist—on piano, and a guy named Vic who was doubling my part because I was singing lead. So there were three guitars and a piano doing the riff. And for all I know, Jimmy Page must have been having dinner with his mother that night.
Jimmy Page and a lot of other people subsequently came to our sessions when we became hot, and I think he played rhythm 12-string on "I'm A Lover, Not A Fighter", and he played tambourine on "Long Tall Shorty". Jon Lord, the organist of Deep Purple, played organ on 'Bald Headed Woman'. The curious thing is I wrote a song called "Revenge" which had a riff like "You Really Got Me". Our publisher at the time was a man named Larry Page. To get a part of the action—this was a real con trick—he registered the song as a co-composer, and he wasn't even on the session for the demo. So maybe the fact that Larry Page was credited as co-composer of Revenge" adds some substantial evidence to Jimmy Page's claim.
I remember Page coming to one of our sessions when we were recording "All Day And All Of The Night". We had to record that song at 10 o'clock in the morning because we had a gig that night. It was done in three hours. Page was doing a session in the other studio, and he came in to hear Dave's solo, and he laughed and he snickered. And now he says that he played it! So I think he's an asshole, and he can put all the curses he wants on me because I know I'm right and he's wrong. He's an asshole. Dave is a great guitar player. He's got his limitations, but he's never been given justice for doing that. He made that when he was 16-years-old. He created a sound, and after that came Jimi Hendrix and all the fuzz boxes.
How long do you think the Kinks can continue as a band?
Let's put it like this. I don't think there's any end to what we can do. I don't want to end up in a Holiday Inn. I'd rather sweep the streets because I'd be better at that. I'd be more artistic at that anyway. That's the last thing I want to do—cabaret and all that bullshit. But I like to feel that every show is the last one we're going to do because that gives us the fire.
How seriously do you think rock 'n' roll should be taken?
How seriously should it be taken? As seriously as the CBS News. Because there's a lot of junk said in rock 'n' roll—there's a lot of junk lyrics—but there's a lot of great lyrics and a lot of great music as well.
I think what's happened—it's got to be taken a bit seriously because it's become this huge industry. There's, so much at stake. You wouldn't believe the wheeling and dealing that's going on to get us to play with the Rolling Stones. I think it really is a big business, and I came into it just to play music. The big companies have got their schedules, they've got their quotas, they've got their money allocated to artists, and it's all very important. It's also a big industry for the government. In the '60s, it was the only thing England had going for it. That's why the Beatles got the MBE. Rock music is really one of our biggest exports. So it's got to be taken a bit serious.
And those people in "Rock 'N' Roll Fantasy"—it helps people get through their life. I said tonight: "Here's a song for a waitress. This is for a queer. Here's a song for a closet queen" or whatever. Everybody's got to have some kind of identification with something. When I first started out, I used to walk around Muswell Hill and say: "I don't relate to any of these people. I've got to get out of here." My way out was through music and art. It's the whole thing in England—the only way to get out is to be a coal miner or a football player. That's the way it was in the '40s and '50s. Now it's rock music. That's why you get bands like Madness going straight from school and becoming rock musicians. Because there's no other way for them. They can't get jobs. But rock music has given them an understanding and a way of expressing themselves. I think it should be taught in schools.
It's a way of expression for people who before would have just been lumbered in factory jobs, and that would have been the end. It would be like the rough going in Eraserhead. Nothing. And even if these kids make one album or one song, they've made a mark on the world and said something. That's what was the great thing about 1977 and new wave music since then. It might not be the best music. The best music was written a hundred years ago or nearly a hundred years ago. But I'm talking about expressionism. You'll notice that expressionistic art is becoming popular again. I think it's all collective. So in the sense of a guy listening to music on his stereo to keep alive, to give him the will to get up in the morning, I think it is important. That it is as important as the news.
And it's got to stop all this. [He points out the, window.] Eventually people are going to get fed up with what's happening to America and England. The Skinheads have got their music in England. I think there are elements in that, though—I hate to say the word—subversive elements. They're using a lot of innocent people. It's great in England, though. We get a lot of Mod kids and Skinheads at our gigs because the Jam like us.
They do a good version of "David Watts".
It's wonderful. They're getting into our other songs because of that one, and they realize that there is another world apart from that horrible, blank concrete world that's out there—the Eraserhead world. That's why music is so good right now. And that's why rock music is more now than a 19-year-old kid playing to a blonde. That's why you get guys over 30 playing rock music to express themselves. And that's why you have 16-year-old kids playing rock music as well.
read the entire interview @ creemmagazine.com, thanks guys! Nice work!